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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptic zone podcast

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episode number 611 for the 28th of June

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2020 richardsaunders here with you from

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Sydney Australia crisp crisp cool cold

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I hope wherever you are in the southern

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hemisphere you're having a cozy winter

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weekend and if you're in the northern

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hemisphere I hope your weekend is just

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the opposite

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this week's show Trish and chips

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Trish Han kicks off this week's show

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with a report an item and an editorial

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an opinion piece about providing good

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role models for the younger generation

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in particular girls good role models

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good strong female role models in movies

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and TVs and things like that

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following that it's Michelle biggest ma

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with a regular segment logical fallacies

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this week Michelle looks at personal

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astonishment personal astonishment that

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sounds interesting coming up later on in

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the show then we have another think tank

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just yesterday in fact some reporters

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and I got together on the interwebs in a

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virtual meeting and we recorded an

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episode of the think tank and I think

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you'll find this one particularly

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interesting we have our trish han

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Michelle Vickers mom Michelle Franklin

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I'm in the Northern Territory and our

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reporter dr. Cassandra Perryman all the

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way over there in California and we

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discuss the pros and cons of wearing a

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face mask at the moment or depending on

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where you are in the world I guess and

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then a very personal story from dr.

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Cassandra Perryman about her experience

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with having covert 19 and especially

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when we think there are large groups of

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people out there who are still of the

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opinion that covert 19 is nothing too

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dramatic it's just another flu or

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another cold nor even the ridiculous

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theories that it's been planned or

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or it's a government plot and it's not

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really happening something to bear in

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mind when you listen to the harrowing

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reports of what it's really like for

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some people to get covert 19 anyway

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that's the think-tank coming later to

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round off this week's episode now if you

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enjoyed last week Maynard's interview

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with George Robb it's interesting that

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that interview was crafted out of a very

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much longer interview Maynard did with

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geo which he then re crafted into a

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completely different interview for his

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podcast so it was the one long session

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with George I crafted it for the skeptic

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zone he got the same information and

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crafted it for his show at Maynard comm

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got a you planet Maynard it's a little

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bit of crossover but both interviews are

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very interesting so I suggest if you are

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a fan of George Robb head over to

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Maynard comm today you sign up for

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maynard's podcasts including planet

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Maynard and bunga bunga and you'll hear

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the the flipside of the interview with

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George rub stay tuned at the end of the

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episode for more announcements from me

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but now it's time for me to run

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downstairs and on such a crisp cold

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winter's morning maybe some cheese

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toasties mmm with a little bit of a

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little bit of wasabi I quite like that

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in melted cheese it's quite a taste well

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I do that watching out for the skeptics

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own cats who I just heard running around

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outside the studio I hope you enjoy this

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gift exam

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hmm let's have some Trish and chips his

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Trish Han a couple of weeks ago on this

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very podcast

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richardsaunders exposed one of my

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shameful secrets to the world and to a

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paleontologist yes I am a Jurassic Park

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obsessive what Richard chose not to

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mention was that the party in question

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wasn't just a party with a film on in

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the background oh no most of us were in

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costume

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there were props a dino skin cake and

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mosquitos in amber jelly

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[Music]

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because how can you not love it

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it's got life-sized animatronic

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dinosaurs samuel l.jackson a beautiful

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score by John Williams Kiwi legends Sam

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Neill and a lawyer getting bitten in

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half while on the loo when the film came

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out in 1993 I was 10 years old and I had

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two major interests animals and

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computers I didn't get to see it until

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it was out on VHS a year later and at

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that point I was spending all my time

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outside of school either on a pony or

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mucking around on ms-dos one of these is

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a fairly conventionally feminine

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activity and the other is not

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and I suffered for it being a nerd in

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the 90s was excellent ammunition for

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bullies and I was regularly made to feel

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like a subhuman purely because I wasn't

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interested in normal girl things even my

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cat Quine activities weren't

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particularly girly often I was standing

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around in the rain up to my knees in mud

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this was England after all picking apart

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pony poo to make sure the worming

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tablets had worked so imagine my

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absolute delight when this film appeared

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featuring two female characters who I

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could actually relate to now I'm not one

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of those thousands of Millennials who

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saw Jurassic Park and went on to become

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a paleontologist because yes while it

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was certainly not terribly accurate in

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its portrayal of those terrifying

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lizards it definitely inspired a massive

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increase in kids looking into

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paleontology as a career choice know

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what this film did for me was to

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reinforce the idea that it was okay for

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girls to be nerds and to get our hands

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dirty

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the scene where dr. Ellie Sattler is

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elbow deep in Triceratops poo was a

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really familiar moment for me the men

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are standing there watching while our

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heroine is squeezing which Reich's

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tongue pustules and checking its poo for

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berries I loved it Sata's role in the

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film from that point for words basically

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involved saving everyone's lives she

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spots the crumpled remnants of the car

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from the t-rex attack and realizes that

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the kids and dr. grant might still be

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alive

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she rebukes Hammonds sexist assertion

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that she wouldn't be able to help

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restore power to the park and she

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manages to do so evading the

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velociraptors who have eaten almost

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everyone else who ventured outside

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but you don't have been me really going

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why and your own block come on let's go

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we can discuss sexism and survival

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situations when I get back and just take

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me through this step-by-step and one

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channel that scene where she's at the

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control panel turning on each power

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board while grant and the kids are

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climbing over the electric fence is one

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of the tensest moments of cinema I've

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ever seen

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shortly afterwards it's our younger

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heroines turn Timmy

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Hammond's grandson is definitely a nerd

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that's a given and his sister Lex grates

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him for it all the while being a massive

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computer geek herself she's Pro trade as

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being a bit of a precious brat in the

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film she's vegetarian she doesn't like

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dirt she's not particularly interested

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in the dinosaurs arguably she caused the

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t-rex to attack the cars but then later

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on she absolutely nails it in the

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kitchen when the Raptors try and kill

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her and her brother and while the adults

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are flailing around wildly trying to

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lock a door that clearly should have

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been designed better she sits in front

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of the computer breathlessly announces

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[Music]

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and proceeds to save everyone's lives by

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not only locking the door and keeping

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the raptors out but also by turning on

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the phone system so they can call for

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help

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this was groundbreaking ly inspirational

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for me as a kid building my first 486 PC

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while my peers were giggling about boys

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and trying on makeup a phrase often

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ascribed to Gloria Steinem is if you

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can't see it you can't be it and while

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this is somewhat hyperbolic it

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definitely has an element of truth to it

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if there had been more female nerds in

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popular culture when I was a kid perhaps

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I would have felt more comfortable being

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one maybe I would have been bullied less

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for it I worked as an IT manager for six

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years in my 20s and the sexism I

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encountered was so constant it was

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basically background noise but maybe if

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the movie hackers had featured a

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predominantly female cast who weren't

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just there to look pretty women might

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have had a better time working in the

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tech industry instead of being

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constantly referred to as secretaries

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now I'm being idealistic but honestly

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female representation is important and

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it definitely goes both ways

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if male nurses were portrayed better in

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TV and film maybe they wouldn't be

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regarded so poorly by the public I'll

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never forget hearing a colleague being

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asked if he failed as a doctor because

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he was a nurse you could argue that

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perhaps as a society we shouldn't be so

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easily influenced by pop culture but

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unfortunately we are and we might as

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well use its powers for good

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it's 20/20 and there is still a regular

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backlash

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every time a female led superhero movie

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comes out and if the characters are

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female and not white

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yikes the fact that women are often

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thrown into the category of minorities

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is flabbergasting bearing in mind we

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make up half the population so imagine

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what it might be like to be a 12 year

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old Aboriginal girl with an interest in

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science whose stock standard role models

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are predominantly older white men with

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questionable ethics it's not terribly

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inspiring for the kids of today so I

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think we can do better

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traditional gender roles are harmful and

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they hold us as a society back when we

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dis raid or punish people for not

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conforming if you're a woman in science

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and you have a film or TV series which

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you credit with inspiring you in your

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field I'd love to hear about it please

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drop by the sceptic Zone Facebook page

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and leave a comment I creates dinosaurs

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go destroy his dinosaur hands God

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creates a man man destroys God man

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creates to head aside dinosaurs eat man

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woman inherits the earth this has been

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Trish Han defending my love of Jurassic

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Park for the sceptic zone

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today this is dr. Karl Karl Chris must

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be proud to be skeptic and you can find

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out more about me at dr. Karl calm and

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[Music]

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logical fallacies

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[Music]

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what are logical fallacies and why is it

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important that critical thinkers should

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know about them

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a logical fallacy is an error we can

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make in reasoning but it usually crops

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up when we are discussing or arguing our

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00:12:46,590 --> 00:12:44,170
point of view some people might even

276
00:12:48,300 --> 00:12:46,600
knowingly use them to try and score

277
00:12:52,199 --> 00:12:48,310
cheap points in an argument

278
00:12:54,780 --> 00:12:52,209
due to intellectual laziness they are

279
00:12:57,030 --> 00:12:54,790
traps we can fall into but if we know

280
00:12:59,309 --> 00:12:57,040
what to look out for we can spot them

281
00:13:01,840 --> 00:12:59,319
when they occur and stop ourselves from

282
00:13:03,170 --> 00:13:01,850
using them

283
00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:03,180
[Music]

284
00:13:10,370 --> 00:13:06,450
this time we'll look at the argument

285
00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:10,380
from personal incredulity also known as

286
00:13:17,090 --> 00:13:13,250
the argument from personal astonishment

287
00:13:19,130 --> 00:13:17,100
this is when someone cannot accept an

288
00:13:21,680 --> 00:13:19,140
argument because they don't believe in

289
00:13:24,890 --> 00:13:21,690
it or they don't understand the premise

290
00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:24,900
and the points being made that is to say

291
00:13:31,460 --> 00:13:27,090
they think it's false because they

292
00:13:34,460 --> 00:13:31,470
cannot see how it can be true if someone

293
00:13:39,410 --> 00:13:34,470
is incredulous it means they are unable

294
00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:39,420
or unwilling to believe something this

295
00:13:46,490 --> 00:13:42,930
might happen to any of us but as if our

296
00:13:48,530 --> 00:13:46,500
it pays to keep an open mind there is no

297
00:13:50,870 --> 00:13:48,540
way the psychic could have known the

298
00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:50,880
things she did about me I didn't tell

299
00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:54,210
her anything yet she named members of my

300
00:14:00,080 --> 00:13:57,170
family by using her gift of clairvoyance

301
00:14:02,810 --> 00:14:00,090
there's just no other explanation

302
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:02,820
one of the classic red flags for

303
00:14:09,530 --> 00:14:05,930
skeptics is when someone has a so-called

304
00:14:13,190 --> 00:14:09,540
psychic reading and says it was

305
00:14:16,790 --> 00:14:13,200
amazingly accurate they could not have

306
00:14:22,430 --> 00:14:16,800
known these things about me and never

307
00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:22,440
told anyone about them or that psychic

308
00:14:29,090 --> 00:14:26,250
was spot-on and I'm a skeptic now of

309
00:14:32,180 --> 00:14:29,100
course not many people make a study of

310
00:14:35,150 --> 00:14:32,190
cold reading which is the most often

311
00:14:38,900 --> 00:14:35,160
used method of doing what appears to be

312
00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:38,910
a psychic reading as most cities are

313
00:14:46,220 --> 00:14:41,730
ignorant of the psychological interplay

314
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:46,230
at work they assume quite naturally that

315
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:48,930
the person they are seeing must really

316
00:14:56,930 --> 00:14:53,850
be psychic think of it this way when you

317
00:14:59,770 --> 00:14:56,940
see a great magician amazed and stunned

318
00:15:03,530 --> 00:14:59,780
and audience by doing the impossible you

319
00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:03,540
know deep down it is just a trick and

320
00:15:11,330 --> 00:15:08,730
not real in this case however not

321
00:15:13,940 --> 00:15:11,340
knowing how the trick works does not

322
00:15:16,510 --> 00:15:13,950
lead you to think magic is real as you

323
00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:16,520
know better they say

324
00:15:21,220 --> 00:15:18,050
that vaccination is safe and effective

325
00:15:23,260 --> 00:15:21,230
but I cannot see how jabbing a poor

326
00:15:25,620 --> 00:15:23,270
innocent baby with a needle full of

327
00:15:28,660 --> 00:15:25,630
toxins can be good

328
00:15:30,930 --> 00:15:28,670
somewhere in there amongst all the

329
00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:30,940
emotive language and scare mongering

330
00:15:37,870 --> 00:15:33,650
it's an argument from personal

331
00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:37,880
incredulity if something works it works

332
00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:40,730
regardless of whether we understand it

333
00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:44,090
or not and regardless of whether we are

334
00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:48,050
opposed to it or not yes we do take a

335
00:15:54,340 --> 00:15:50,410
lot of things on trust in our society

336
00:15:56,860 --> 00:15:54,350
when it comes to vaccinations we trust

337
00:15:59,650 --> 00:15:56,870
that the doctors and medical scientists

338
00:16:02,590 --> 00:15:59,660
know what they are doing and what they

339
00:16:07,270 --> 00:16:02,600
offer does work even if we don't

340
00:16:10,390 --> 00:16:07,280
understand it ourselves however if we

341
00:16:13,540 --> 00:16:10,400
took the time and effort we could come

342
00:16:16,710 --> 00:16:13,550
to understand it and understanding the

343
00:16:21,190 --> 00:16:16,720
basic principles of how vaccines work

344
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:21,200
it's really not that difficult how crazy

345
00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:23,930
it is to believe the world is some sort

346
00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:27,410
of spinning ball in space I can't feel

347
00:16:32,860 --> 00:16:30,110
it spin when I'm flying in a plane the

348
00:16:36,580 --> 00:16:32,870
horizon still looks flat how is that

349
00:16:39,010 --> 00:16:36,590
possible if the world was a globe here

350
00:16:42,430 --> 00:16:39,020
we have a case of someone not willing or

351
00:16:45,700 --> 00:16:42,440
not wanting to believe a premise in this

352
00:16:48,420 --> 00:16:45,710
case the shape of the world as it

353
00:16:52,420 --> 00:16:48,430
contradicts what they accept to be true

354
00:16:56,290 --> 00:16:52,430
based on their own observations in the

355
00:16:59,860 --> 00:16:56,300
case of many flat earthers also known as

356
00:17:02,350 --> 00:16:59,870
globe deniers it's also based on the

357
00:17:06,390 --> 00:17:02,360
information they get from online blogs

358
00:17:12,650 --> 00:17:06,400
and videos by other flat-earthers

359
00:17:17,670 --> 00:17:15,840
being incredulous might serve you well

360
00:17:20,340 --> 00:17:17,680
when you first encounter an

361
00:17:22,189 --> 00:17:20,350
extraordinary claim that flies in the

362
00:17:26,809 --> 00:17:22,199
face of everything you know

363
00:17:28,910 --> 00:17:26,819
but as Carl Sagan famously said

364
00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:28,920
extraordinary claims require

365
00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:34,450
extraordinary proof so don't be afraid

366
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:37,090
to at least look at any extraordinary

367
00:17:45,450 --> 00:17:43,090
proof that is offered knowing a logical

368
00:17:47,820 --> 00:17:45,460
fallacy when you hear one and even

369
00:17:51,690 --> 00:17:47,830
knowing its name is important when

370
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:51,700
arguing your point of view however you

371
00:17:57,210 --> 00:17:54,490
may come across as arrogant and not get

372
00:17:59,220 --> 00:17:57,220
very far if you call it out by name to

373
00:18:03,510 --> 00:17:59,230
your opponent when you hear it being

374
00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:03,520
used if your opponent calls you out for

375
00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:06,250
using one it's time to stop and think

376
00:18:11,900 --> 00:18:10,330
about how you are making your case use

377
00:18:15,660 --> 00:18:11,910
your knowledge of logical fallacies

378
00:18:18,300 --> 00:18:15,670
wisely and remember that even if your

379
00:18:21,150 --> 00:18:18,310
point of view is right and you know all

380
00:18:23,460 --> 00:18:21,160
the pitfalls in arguing your case it

381
00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:23,470
doesn't always mean you'll win on the

382
00:18:33,390 --> 00:18:27,490
day and a skeptics we must also remember

383
00:18:35,940 --> 00:18:33,400
that we too can be wrong at times I'm

384
00:18:46,750 --> 00:18:35,950
sure because my from the VEX skeptics

385
00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:54,299
[Music]

386
00:19:00,180 --> 00:18:56,230
to the director

387
00:19:05,260 --> 00:19:00,190
boundless energy proprietary limited

388
00:19:12,610 --> 00:19:05,270
basement level over unity building 1 965

389
00:19:18,220 --> 00:19:12,620
dodgy Lane Sydney dear madam I am

390
00:19:22,360 --> 00:19:18,230
writing to you with questions about my

391
00:19:28,169 --> 00:19:22,370
purchase of your free energy device the

392
00:19:37,810 --> 00:19:34,539
also known as the S C am 50 as my

393
00:19:43,020 --> 00:19:37,820
various attempts to phone and email your

394
00:19:51,370 --> 00:19:47,530
although I understand your building has

395
00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:51,380
been suffering blackouts of late it has

396
00:20:01,419 --> 00:19:56,770
caused me some frustration in regards to

397
00:20:05,890 --> 00:20:01,429
communication my problem is this the

398
00:20:08,830 --> 00:20:05,900
instructions for the S C am 50 state

399
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:08,840
that I need to plug it into a power

400
00:20:19,450 --> 00:20:15,410
outlet in my home in order to quote warm

401
00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:19,460
it up in the quote before use I am

402
00:20:28,780 --> 00:20:22,970
surprised that this warming up period is

403
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:28,790
listed as six months to a year is this

404
00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:31,970
correct as the machine does in fact heat

405
00:20:41,830 --> 00:20:36,650
up quite quickly when plugged in and the

406
00:20:45,460 --> 00:20:41,840
large sliding lever on the side is

407
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:45,470
pressed down this heating goes on for

408
00:20:54,610 --> 00:20:50,010
approximately 3 minutes before suddenly

409
00:20:59,240 --> 00:20:54,620
stubborn I am also somewhat surprised

410
00:21:00,160 --> 00:20:59,250
that the model of the device you sent to

411
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:00,170
me

412
00:21:10,190 --> 00:21:06,090
resembles a $30 Kmart toaster but I

413
00:21:14,690 --> 00:21:10,200
understand it is only a disguise as the

414
00:21:20,150 --> 00:21:14,700
government and large oil companies want

415
00:21:23,300 --> 00:21:20,160
to suppress free energy machines until

416
00:21:26,540 --> 00:21:23,310
the device is fully functional would it

417
00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:26,550
be advisable for me to make toast

418
00:21:35,090 --> 00:21:31,770
in the meantime please be so kind as to

419
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:35,100
contact me when power is that last

420
00:21:50,300 --> 00:21:39,810
restored to your company yours etc and

421
00:21:54,830 --> 00:21:50,310
etc PS would it be helpful if I plug the

422
00:22:01,730 --> 00:21:54,840
device into itself to power itself while

423
00:22:07,180 --> 00:22:03,720
[Music]

424
00:22:14,290 --> 00:22:07,190
join us now for drinking skeptically in

425
00:22:17,260 --> 00:22:14,300
the think tank well folks once again

426
00:22:19,390 --> 00:22:17,270
welcome to the think tank i'll

427
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:19,400
semi-regular get together we used to do

428
00:22:22,990 --> 00:22:22,010
it all together in person at the club at

429
00:22:24,700 --> 00:22:23,000
the end of the street where we would

430
00:22:26,890 --> 00:22:24,710
enjoy a big dinner and a couple of

431
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:26,900
drinks and chat about sceptical issues

432
00:22:29,380 --> 00:22:28,610
of the day but like so much in our

433
00:22:32,230 --> 00:22:29,390
modern world

434
00:22:34,450 --> 00:22:32,240
we've gone online joining me in the

435
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:34,460
think tank this week from Melbourne

436
00:22:38,380 --> 00:22:36,290
Australia we have Michelle Vickers MA

437
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:38,390
hello Michelle hello very nice to be

438
00:22:43,330 --> 00:22:42,170
here in on the other part in another

439
00:22:44,770 --> 00:22:43,340
part of the country we have another

440
00:22:46,660 --> 00:22:44,780
Michelle Michelle Franklin in the

441
00:22:48,700 --> 00:22:46,670
Northern Territory up near Darwin hello

442
00:22:51,100 --> 00:22:48,710
Michelle hello Richard thanks for having

443
00:22:53,380 --> 00:22:51,110
me I'll oh good to see you again - right

444
00:22:55,420 --> 00:22:53,390
here in Sydney we have Trish hun hello

445
00:22:58,570 --> 00:22:55,430
Trish Hey

446
00:23:00,520 --> 00:22:58,580
Hey good and thank you very much for

447
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:00,530
your little segment earlier on in the

448
00:23:04,540 --> 00:23:03,290
show about inspiring the especially the

449
00:23:08,830 --> 00:23:04,550
younger generation I thought that was

450
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:08,840
very good and our reporter we seldom

451
00:23:13,930 --> 00:23:11,210
hear from so I'm delighted that she's on

452
00:23:16,390 --> 00:23:13,940
the show again today dr. Cassandra

453
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:16,400
Perryman all the way over there in

454
00:23:22,300 --> 00:23:19,970
California in Folsom California hello hi

455
00:23:24,130 --> 00:23:22,310
Richard it's been a long time but glad

456
00:23:27,370 --> 00:23:24,140
that our times finally well synched up

457
00:23:29,740 --> 00:23:27,380
yes it has indeed and it's so wonderful

458
00:23:31,450 --> 00:23:29,750
to to sit here in the skeptic zone

459
00:23:33,100 --> 00:23:31,460
studios and see you all I can almost

460
00:23:35,170 --> 00:23:33,110
pretend that we're actually around the

461
00:23:36,850 --> 00:23:35,180
dinner table you know we've just enjoyed

462
00:23:38,980 --> 00:23:36,860
our dinner we're having a few drinks and

463
00:23:41,260 --> 00:23:38,990
we can talk about some issues of the day

464
00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:41,270
we're going to start off with one of the

465
00:23:47,650 --> 00:23:43,970
the strangest and the most vexing issues

466
00:23:49,780 --> 00:23:47,660
that has come our way since Cove at 19

467
00:23:51,730 --> 00:23:49,790
and that's the strange situation of

468
00:23:54,130 --> 00:23:51,740
should I wear a mask or should I not

469
00:23:55,510 --> 00:23:54,140
wear a mask now Trish you did a report

470
00:23:57,370 --> 00:23:55,520
for the skeptics on hundreds of years

471
00:23:59,830 --> 00:23:57,380
ago it seems but really it was only

472
00:24:03,250 --> 00:23:59,840
February this year about the pros and

473
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:03,260
cons of wearing masks what's the latest

474
00:24:08,470 --> 00:24:06,410
what what should we do oh you know what

475
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:08,480
no one knows and we're in an interesting

476
00:24:12,550 --> 00:24:10,250
situation especially you know with this

477
00:24:13,090 --> 00:24:12,560
current conversation we were all over

478
00:24:16,120 --> 00:24:13,100
the place

479
00:24:17,950 --> 00:24:16,130
there is no hard and fast rule for

480
00:24:19,390 --> 00:24:17,960
everyone which is good it means that

481
00:24:21,220 --> 00:24:19,400
different places are coping differently

482
00:24:23,049 --> 00:24:21,230
back in February

483
00:24:25,930 --> 00:24:23,059
people were already starting to wear

484
00:24:28,330 --> 00:24:25,940
masks I noticed just around Sydney which

485
00:24:31,169 --> 00:24:28,340
I think the arguments are that we don't

486
00:24:33,310 --> 00:24:31,179
really need to here it's very

487
00:24:36,340 --> 00:24:33,320
situationally dependent obviously like

488
00:24:37,690 --> 00:24:36,350
if you're gonna sew at the moment I made

489
00:24:39,460 --> 00:24:37,700
a bunch of masks at the beginning of all

490
00:24:41,409 --> 00:24:39,470
this for me to wear on my way to work

491
00:24:42,789 --> 00:24:41,419
because I was noticing that although

492
00:24:44,650 --> 00:24:42,799
there weren't as many people out on the

493
00:24:46,450 --> 00:24:44,660
streets as there were before they

494
00:24:47,860 --> 00:24:46,460
weren't really socially distancing as

495
00:24:49,029 --> 00:24:47,870
they should so I'd be stood at the

496
00:24:49,980 --> 00:24:49,039
traffic lights waiting to cross and

497
00:24:52,630 --> 00:24:49,990
someone would come and stand

498
00:24:54,970 --> 00:24:52,640
uncomfortably close but when I was

499
00:24:56,470 --> 00:24:54,980
wearing the mask suddenly I had all the

500
00:24:59,320 --> 00:24:56,480
space in the world and I could you know

501
00:25:01,419 --> 00:24:59,330
really enjoy that personal space then

502
00:25:03,250 --> 00:25:01,429
the space invaders came back and he kind

503
00:25:04,570 --> 00:25:03,260
of realized that actually the masks

504
00:25:05,950 --> 00:25:04,580
weren't doing anything so I have now

505
00:25:07,930 --> 00:25:05,960
stopped wearing a mask on my way to work

506
00:25:09,399 --> 00:25:07,940
but then that's just purely because my

507
00:25:10,870 --> 00:25:09,409
trip to work takes me ten minutes on our

508
00:25:12,909 --> 00:25:10,880
scooter I'm not really interacting with

509
00:25:14,620 --> 00:25:12,919
anyone however if you're using public

510
00:25:16,510 --> 00:25:14,630
transport if you're going to be inside

511
00:25:19,870 --> 00:25:16,520
especially where there's you know non

512
00:25:23,020 --> 00:25:19,880
non circulated air it might be prudent

513
00:25:25,060 --> 00:25:23,030
to wear a mask however in an area where

514
00:25:26,380 --> 00:25:25,070
there is I don't really want to say that

515
00:25:29,230 --> 00:25:26,390
it's it's everywhere but it is

516
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:29,240
everywhere in some places masks are

517
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:31,610
being mandated so I know that in the UK

518
00:25:34,779 --> 00:25:33,530
on public transport they will not let

519
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:34,789
you on to public transport without a

520
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:38,090
mask in quite a few American states

521
00:25:42,430 --> 00:25:40,250
you're mandated to wear a mask as soon

522
00:25:45,430 --> 00:25:42,440
as you leave your house and what this

523
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:45,440
has done is we've almost got they seem

524
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:47,330
like a very similar response as the anti

525
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:49,250
boxes in that people are now coming out

526
00:25:53,860 --> 00:25:52,010
with every excuse Under the Sun to not

527
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:53,870
wear a mask and quite frankly it's

528
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:55,730
bizarre because I'm hearing all this

529
00:25:59,260 --> 00:25:57,530
talk and I'm thinking like people are

530
00:26:01,210 --> 00:25:59,270
saying oh it reduces your oxygen

531
00:26:02,620 --> 00:26:01,220
saturations or it increases your carbon

532
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:02,630
dioxide that you're breathing in your

533
00:26:06,850 --> 00:26:04,370
the net risk of passing out and all I

534
00:26:08,409 --> 00:26:06,860
can think of is well those theater cases

535
00:26:10,539 --> 00:26:08,419
that I'm in that go on for sometimes

536
00:26:17,820 --> 00:26:10,549
twelve hours and I'm wearing a mask the

537
00:26:21,580 --> 00:26:19,990
exactly and all those like those are

538
00:26:23,500 --> 00:26:21,590
just surgical masks but then I think

539
00:26:25,450 --> 00:26:23,510
about some of my friends who do sort of

540
00:26:26,830 --> 00:26:25,460
workshop work where they're either like

541
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:26,840
doing grinding

542
00:26:32,770 --> 00:26:28,610
or doing spray painting and they'll wear

543
00:26:34,990 --> 00:26:32,780
a proper n95 mask again for several

544
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:35,000
hours at a time and my friends were lots

545
00:26:41,410 --> 00:26:39,050
of ghosts apparently you are have you

546
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:41,420
have you seen the the video just doing

547
00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:43,010
the rounds at the moment of people in

548
00:26:49,030 --> 00:26:46,850
Florida I don't wear a mask for the same

549
00:26:54,130 --> 00:26:49,040
reason I don't unware underwear things

550
00:26:56,020 --> 00:26:54,140
gotta breathe thank you for your

551
00:26:59,320 --> 00:26:56,030
comments ma'am and they went to throw

552
00:27:02,470 --> 00:26:59,330
God's wonderful breeding system out the

553
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:02,480
door you're all turning your backs on it

554
00:27:08,890 --> 00:27:05,450
in the beginning God formed man out of

555
00:27:13,810 --> 00:27:08,900
the earth and breathed his breath in him

556
00:27:17,010 --> 00:27:13,820
and he became a living soul where do you

557
00:27:20,740 --> 00:27:17,020
derive the authority to regulate human

558
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:20,750
breathing what you say is the political

559
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:23,450
dogma that they're trying to shove down

560
00:27:29,260 --> 00:27:26,930
our throats on every commercial in every

561
00:27:31,690 --> 00:27:29,270
store and it's disgusting every single

562
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:31,700
one of you that are obeying the devil's

563
00:27:37,540 --> 00:27:34,810
laws are going to be arrested and you

564
00:27:40,150 --> 00:27:37,550
doctor are going to be arrested for

565
00:27:41,950 --> 00:27:40,160
crimes against humanity let me ask you

566
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:41,960
all do you believe your God do you

567
00:27:45,580 --> 00:27:43,490
believe you can override God's divine

568
00:27:47,010 --> 00:27:45,590
plan for our lives you're removing our

569
00:27:49,540 --> 00:27:47,020
freedoms and stomping on our

570
00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:49,550
constitutional rights by these communist

571
00:27:53,890 --> 00:27:51,770
dictatorship orders or laws you want to

572
00:27:56,170 --> 00:27:53,900
mandate you literally cannot mandate

573
00:27:58,390 --> 00:27:56,180
somebody to wear a mask knowing that

574
00:28:00,460 --> 00:27:58,400
that mask is killing people it literally

575
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:00,470
is killing people much of our

576
00:28:04,170 --> 00:28:02,570
communication is nonverbal which

577
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:04,180
includes facial expressions gestures

578
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:06,650
displayed and the physical distance

579
00:28:10,450 --> 00:28:09,050
between the communicators how will young

580
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:10,460
children be able to know who the

581
00:28:14,050 --> 00:28:12,650
dangerous deviants are like pedophiles

582
00:28:18,900 --> 00:28:14,060
and people in the human sex trafficking

583
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:18,910
you did not listen to We the People I

584
00:28:24,490 --> 00:28:21,650
would die for that country I would die

585
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:24,500
for the Constitution you know what you

586
00:28:29,260 --> 00:28:27,290
disgraced me you know why you did not

587
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:29,270
listen to me the people you make a

588
00:28:32,950 --> 00:28:31,730
decision I haven't worn a mask yet I'm

589
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:32,960
not wearing it today

590
00:28:35,900 --> 00:28:34,410
besides despite

591
00:28:38,270 --> 00:28:35,910
you guys do up here today I'm not

592
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:38,280
wearing one tomorrow I was born free I

593
00:28:41,630 --> 00:28:39,930
will stay free my rights come from God

594
00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:41,640
not from you I'm not wearing it you're

595
00:28:46,010 --> 00:28:42,930
gonna have to hold me down and put it on

596
00:28:48,590 --> 00:28:46,020
me we are a nation of shared values I

597
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:48,600
can see everybody heads what does it

598
00:28:53,470 --> 00:28:50,850
facepalming at the moment I would love

599
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:53,480
to pretend that that's only in Florida

600
00:28:59,000 --> 00:28:56,730
California just mandated mass it's

601
00:29:02,480 --> 00:28:59,010
actually a misdemeanor now to not wear

602
00:29:05,450 --> 00:29:02,490
one inside of a public building and you

603
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:05,460
should hear the Tantrums it's almost

604
00:29:10,220 --> 00:29:07,770
like you can see the political divide

605
00:29:12,110 --> 00:29:10,230
but who was wearing a mask and who was

606
00:29:15,940 --> 00:29:12,120
not wearing a mask in this country right

607
00:29:18,890 --> 00:29:15,950
now hmm and I live in a very purple town

608
00:29:21,020 --> 00:29:18,900
intel is here right so Intel's brought a

609
00:29:24,020 --> 00:29:21,030
lot of immigrant workers into the town

610
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:24,030
and and a lot of diversity and then

611
00:29:28,370 --> 00:29:26,370
there's the old guard that has their

612
00:29:30,890 --> 00:29:28,380
guns and they're lifted trucks and yes

613
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:30,900
I'm stereotyping my town but it's

614
00:29:35,620 --> 00:29:32,490
amazing because you could almost

615
00:29:39,550 --> 00:29:35,630
guarantee that that stereotypical white

616
00:29:42,410 --> 00:29:39,560
GMC truck is gonna pull up and the

617
00:29:43,820 --> 00:29:42,420
individual is who gets out of it is not

618
00:29:45,500 --> 00:29:43,830
gonna be wearing a mask and they're

619
00:29:48,410 --> 00:29:45,510
gonna have an NRA sticker on the back

620
00:29:52,070 --> 00:29:48,420
and it's getting comical like it really

621
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:52,080
is but it it has created such a bizarre

622
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:54,930
rift and not only is it Devils Baskin

623
00:30:00,110 --> 00:29:57,810
God made this respiratory system how

624
00:30:03,110 --> 00:30:00,120
dare you suppress it but it's also being

625
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:03,120
equated to gun rights look it's gotten

626
00:30:07,940 --> 00:30:06,330
that insane you're not taking my gun cuz

627
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:07,950
that's not freedom and you're not making

628
00:30:13,550 --> 00:30:09,930
me wear a mask because that's my freedom

629
00:30:15,890 --> 00:30:13,560
it sums up here yeah but it's everywhere

630
00:30:18,020 --> 00:30:15,900
it's everywhere but I was reading a

631
00:30:21,470 --> 00:30:18,030
little bit about the psychology behind

632
00:30:24,110 --> 00:30:21,480
it last night and it's everything that

633
00:30:28,100 --> 00:30:24,120
you have all already said about freedom

634
00:30:30,650 --> 00:30:28,110
about God making respiratory systems God

635
00:30:32,510 --> 00:30:30,660
will choose whose life but some other

636
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:32,520
really interesting things - about the

637
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:36,450
fatigue and wearing a mark people are

638
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:39,570
just sick of the whole thing so masks is

639
00:30:45,950 --> 00:30:43,050
part of that it's it's they just want it

640
00:30:48,260 --> 00:30:45,960
to go away wearing a mask reminds them

641
00:30:50,270 --> 00:30:48,270
that it hasn't gone away

642
00:30:55,370 --> 00:30:50,280
hmm and then there's some really

643
00:30:59,180 --> 00:30:55,380
insidious things to like because there's

644
00:31:01,669 --> 00:30:59,190
a high uptake of mask-wearing in Asians

645
00:31:04,850 --> 00:31:01,679
that it that is threatened threatening

646
00:31:08,270 --> 00:31:04,860
to some people that we are not being

647
00:31:11,450 --> 00:31:08,280
like like Asians that there's a racist

648
00:31:15,500 --> 00:31:11,460
element to to that and also even I've

649
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:15,510
seen some horrible graphics about you

650
00:31:26,150 --> 00:31:17,730
know being the thin edge of the wedge to

651
00:31:28,220 --> 00:31:26,160
wearing full burqa where it was first

652
00:31:30,290 --> 00:31:28,230
you tire mask around and then it just

653
00:31:33,799 --> 00:31:30,300
builds up to your whole face is covered

654
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:33,809
and against I said some hideous racist

655
00:31:39,169 --> 00:31:36,570
things and we've seen that too starting

656
00:31:42,049 --> 00:31:39,179
to emerge in Melbourne with you know a

657
00:31:44,270 --> 00:31:42,059
political commentator stirring the pot

658
00:31:46,010 --> 00:31:44,280
yesterday Melbourne is in the in the

659
00:31:47,330 --> 00:31:46,020
unfortunate situation in the state of

660
00:31:50,270 --> 00:31:47,340
Victoria of having somewhat of a

661
00:31:53,780 --> 00:31:50,280
resurgence over there we've got people

662
00:31:57,230 --> 00:31:53,790
stirring the pot about it being in you

663
00:32:02,090 --> 00:31:57,240
know immigrant areas so there's some

664
00:32:05,090 --> 00:32:02,100
really insidious stuff going on too and

665
00:32:05,990 --> 00:32:05,100
yeah yeah turns out mask is part of that

666
00:32:08,810 --> 00:32:06,000
as well

667
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:08,820
just frightening yeah just a whole that

668
00:32:14,210 --> 00:32:11,610
whole denialism wanting it to go away

669
00:32:16,370 --> 00:32:14,220
point I thought was interesting you know

670
00:32:30,669 --> 00:32:16,380
if I it's like if we don't test we wait

671
00:32:36,020 --> 00:32:33,380
is this the answer it's surely if we

672
00:32:39,110 --> 00:32:36,030
don't test anybody there's no no no

673
00:32:42,500 --> 00:32:39,120
curve it reported right Trish that works

674
00:32:44,450 --> 00:32:42,510
right yeah oh definitely if you if you

675
00:32:45,650 --> 00:32:44,460
don't test for it well that it's a

676
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:45,660
really good way of cutting down on

677
00:32:50,390 --> 00:32:47,130
teenage pregnancies as well as if you

678
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:50,400
don't pregnancy test teenage women then

679
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:51,450
they won't be pregnant

680
00:32:56,810 --> 00:32:54,090
so not obviously not pregnant yeah well

681
00:32:59,150 --> 00:32:56,820
dr. Norman Swan on corona cast last

682
00:33:02,109 --> 00:32:59,160
night was saying he still doesn't think

683
00:33:04,929 --> 00:33:02,119
that look australia-wide West

684
00:33:07,869 --> 00:33:04,939
we'll have low enough community spread

685
00:33:08,289 --> 00:33:07,879
to not really take up my square anchor

686
00:33:10,479 --> 00:33:08,299
it

687
00:33:13,329 --> 00:33:10,489
Vaska more helpful when you don't know

688
00:33:17,409 --> 00:33:13,339
where it is then when you what you do

689
00:33:20,319 --> 00:33:17,419
you mean like yeah but wait we know

690
00:33:24,429 --> 00:33:20,329
where it is in Melbourne yeah but he was

691
00:33:26,769 --> 00:33:24,439
saying really like public transport may

692
00:33:29,319 --> 00:33:26,779
be a good place to where in crowds you

693
00:33:31,659 --> 00:33:29,329
know like the black lives matter rally

694
00:33:34,839 --> 00:33:31,669
the wearing of masks was very widespread

695
00:33:35,859 --> 00:33:34,849
and so things like that if you're in a

696
00:33:38,129 --> 00:33:35,869
crowded place

697
00:33:40,989 --> 00:33:38,139
public transport shopping centers

698
00:33:42,909 --> 00:33:40,999
rallies that might still be a place to

699
00:33:44,469 --> 00:33:42,919
do it but you're getting back to the

700
00:33:48,309 --> 00:33:44,479
Melbourne scenario you know we're still

701
00:33:51,579 --> 00:33:48,319
like 30 cases a day still low community

702
00:33:54,009 --> 00:33:51,589
transmission by world standards high by

703
00:33:55,899 --> 00:33:54,019
Australian standards so yeah no masks

704
00:33:58,149 --> 00:33:55,909
now the the Northern Territory is a

705
00:33:59,529 --> 00:33:58,159
completely different region and it's

706
00:34:03,429 --> 00:33:59,539
almost like its own world

707
00:34:07,299 --> 00:34:03,439
Michelle yeah and people wearing masks

708
00:34:11,799 --> 00:34:07,309
in your area know about February or

709
00:34:14,829 --> 00:34:11,809
March I saw one guy wearing a mask and

710
00:34:16,690 --> 00:34:14,839
then about a week later I saw a woman

711
00:34:18,489 --> 00:34:16,700
wearing a mask I thought okay now it's

712
00:34:22,089 --> 00:34:18,499
starting and that's it I haven't seen it

713
00:34:23,919 --> 00:34:22,099
since want to go to the Northern

714
00:34:26,710 --> 00:34:23,929
Territory and just turned around to

715
00:34:28,720 --> 00:34:26,720
anyway well nobody needs to well we

716
00:34:32,769 --> 00:34:28,730
don't we don't have covert here we had

717
00:34:35,559 --> 00:34:32,779
30 cases total but yeah we haven't had

718
00:34:37,749 --> 00:34:35,569
any for months and that's amazing it's

719
00:34:40,029 --> 00:34:37,759
like there's more than 30 people in the

720
00:34:45,940 --> 00:34:40,039
Northern Territory hold on no that was

721
00:34:48,729 --> 00:34:45,950
when all the tourists came I am a bit

722
00:34:50,710 --> 00:34:48,739
worried our Chief Minister's just

723
00:34:53,049 --> 00:34:50,720
announced recently that he's opening up

724
00:34:54,549 --> 00:34:53,059
the borders and it wasn't quite worried

725
00:34:56,259 --> 00:34:54,559
what would happen he's gonna let

726
00:35:00,640 --> 00:34:56,269
tourists in because our school holidays

727
00:35:03,549 --> 00:35:00,650
starts today and tourists are gonna be

728
00:35:05,589 --> 00:35:03,559
allowed back in soon and I was worried

729
00:35:07,630 --> 00:35:05,599
but then they've said that only people

730
00:35:11,079 --> 00:35:07,640
who haven't been to certain areas so all

731
00:35:14,079 --> 00:35:11,089
the bad parts of Melbourne and anywhere

732
00:35:15,970 --> 00:35:14,089
that is declared a hotspot so if any

733
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:15,980
other states declare a hotspot

734
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:18,170
automatically those people have to

735
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:20,810
quarantine if they come say I'm feeling

736
00:35:25,780 --> 00:35:23,330
a bit more about it now but yeah well

737
00:35:27,670 --> 00:35:25,790
I'm quite quite pleased I'm quite

738
00:35:30,700 --> 00:35:27,680
pleased that the Northern Territory is

739
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:30,710
doing doing so well and it's a pity that

740
00:35:35,380 --> 00:35:33,050
there's an up kick again in Victoria but

741
00:35:37,810 --> 00:35:35,390
it was sort of on the cards because this

742
00:35:42,450 --> 00:35:37,820
thing is well it is what it is now

743
00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:42,460
speaking of people getting covert 19

744
00:35:50,109 --> 00:35:46,250
Cassandra yeah my goodness me you had it

745
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:50,119
I had it and well what was their

746
00:35:55,930 --> 00:35:53,690
experience like for you laughs it's

747
00:35:58,570 --> 00:35:55,940
still I should say it's not past tense

748
00:36:03,160 --> 00:35:58,580
I'm still carrying some pretty hefty

749
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:03,170
effects but I'm early on in it coming to

750
00:36:08,590 --> 00:36:06,050
California I was still doing volunteer

751
00:36:10,390 --> 00:36:08,600
work at a homeless shelter it's it's the

752
00:36:14,500 --> 00:36:10,400
teen pregnancy issue we nobody was being

753
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:14,510
tested in my area at all and it's not

754
00:36:19,420 --> 00:36:16,130
uncommon when working with the homeless

755
00:36:23,290 --> 00:36:19,430
population to get colds to get the flu

756
00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:23,300
and of all the beautiful here's how the

757
00:36:31,810 --> 00:36:25,010
universe works it was my last night

758
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:31,820
actually and whoever because we screen

759
00:36:35,859 --> 00:36:33,650
for illness when somebody comes into the

760
00:36:37,030 --> 00:36:35,869
shelter so whoever was transmitting it

761
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:37,040
because it's the only place we can

762
00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:38,330
figure I got it from was obviously

763
00:36:43,420 --> 00:36:40,730
asymptomatic and it started out feeling

764
00:36:45,190 --> 00:36:43,430
like a cold and I have multiple

765
00:36:47,140 --> 00:36:45,200
sclerosis and so I'm already

766
00:36:49,990 --> 00:36:47,150
immunocompromised and so when I get

767
00:36:52,359 --> 00:36:50,000
colds that lasts about more than nine

768
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:52,369
days I send a message to my doctor and

769
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:54,170
I'm really privileged on that front as

770
00:36:59,380 --> 00:36:56,530
Americans go I have amazing health care

771
00:37:00,970 --> 00:36:59,390
yeah and sent a message to my doctor and

772
00:37:04,030 --> 00:37:00,980
he said is one of your symptoms trouble

773
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:04,040
breathing and I said eating out a little

774
00:37:08,349 --> 00:37:06,050
bit but it could just be that I'm tired

775
00:37:10,530 --> 00:37:08,359
right Ms does a lot of things and he

776
00:37:13,870 --> 00:37:10,540
goes I want to look at your lungs and

777
00:37:15,310 --> 00:37:13,880
put me in a mask at that point when I

778
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:15,320
got and took an x-ray of my lungs and

779
00:37:23,140 --> 00:37:18,530
went and you have covered and I said

780
00:37:24,430 --> 00:37:23,150
what and he said this is the beginning I

781
00:37:26,470 --> 00:37:24,440
don't know how bad you're gonna get but

782
00:37:28,990 --> 00:37:26,480
if these ten things happen I need you

783
00:37:30,550 --> 00:37:29,000
back in the hospital

784
00:37:31,990 --> 00:37:30,560
and so I'd already been kind of

785
00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:32,000
isolating for my family I'm a bit

786
00:37:36,220 --> 00:37:34,160
pedantic about cleaning and bleaching

787
00:37:38,380 --> 00:37:36,230
things to begin with so thankfully no

788
00:37:41,609 --> 00:37:38,390
spread to my family but I'm locked

789
00:37:47,339 --> 00:37:41,619
myself in the bedroom and two days later

790
00:37:52,030 --> 00:37:47,349
yeah at 3 scariest days of my life and

791
00:37:54,190 --> 00:37:52,040
to this point I have essentially lost 72

792
00:37:55,450 --> 00:37:54,200
hours and you can tell even where I'm

793
00:37:58,660 --> 00:37:55,460
staying like I can talk about it

794
00:38:00,400 --> 00:37:58,670
objectively now I've been hospitalized

795
00:38:03,930 --> 00:38:00,410
I've had some pretty good pneumonia I

796
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:03,940
had a mild to moderate case no

797
00:38:12,330 --> 00:38:08,690
hospitalization and I still I still

798
00:38:15,970 --> 00:38:12,340
can't tell you how terrifying it was I

799
00:38:17,620 --> 00:38:15,980
hike I scuba dive I kayak I do all those

800
00:38:21,310 --> 00:38:17,630
things and I could barely take half a

801
00:38:22,300 --> 00:38:21,320
breath I'd wake up and I'm just fit so

802
00:38:25,660 --> 00:38:22,310
if not breathing

803
00:38:29,710 --> 00:38:25,670
panicked faulting straight up lost just

804
00:38:31,570 --> 00:38:29,720
was so tired and and and so I seriously

805
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:31,580
don't remember more than a couple hours

806
00:38:37,690 --> 00:38:36,170
over three days and thankfully good I

807
00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:37,700
have a great family they're sending a

808
00:38:40,599 --> 00:38:39,410
messages to my doctor like she's at this

809
00:38:42,849 --> 00:38:40,609
stage and my doctor said you know

810
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:42,859
looking at the trend that we have she's

811
00:38:45,220 --> 00:38:44,450
in a really bad spot but she's gonna be

812
00:38:49,839 --> 00:38:45,230
okay

813
00:38:52,210 --> 00:38:49,849
and he was right but even now mm-hmm

814
00:38:54,130 --> 00:38:52,220
going up and down the stairs red stairs

815
00:39:00,400 --> 00:38:54,140
in my house I can't do it more than a

816
00:39:03,550 --> 00:39:00,410
couple times a day I just my lungs still

817
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:03,560
aren't where they should be and that's

818
00:39:07,300 --> 00:39:05,330
the part that I know is an MS I don't

819
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:07,310
have breathing problems with MS I can

820
00:39:13,390 --> 00:39:09,170
get tired and things like that but I I

821
00:39:16,890 --> 00:39:13,400
still have we're talking months out I'm

822
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:16,900
still having a hard time going on a walk

823
00:39:23,980 --> 00:39:20,330
you know and and serious exertion is

824
00:39:26,500 --> 00:39:23,990
just not something still to date I can

825
00:39:27,970 --> 00:39:26,510
give and so when people tell me oh it's

826
00:39:30,940 --> 00:39:27,980
just a cold I'm like you know what I've

827
00:39:33,070 --> 00:39:30,950
had a lot of bloody rhinovirus all right

828
00:39:34,750 --> 00:39:33,080
I've had just about yearly I've had a

829
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:34,760
bloody head cold you want to tell me a

830
00:39:38,890 --> 00:39:37,130
head cold makes you lose three days you

831
00:39:42,750 --> 00:39:38,900
tell me a head cold makes you fear for

832
00:39:44,940 --> 00:39:42,760
your life it's not a head cold Nate

833
00:39:46,829 --> 00:39:44,950
this is not a head cold so many people

834
00:39:48,210 --> 00:39:46,839
are still putting it out there that well

835
00:39:50,550 --> 00:39:48,220
you know the people who think it's a

836
00:39:52,740 --> 00:39:50,560
planned Emma can and it's overblown and

837
00:39:54,420 --> 00:39:52,750
everything oh it's just the same virus

838
00:39:56,579 --> 00:39:54,430
as a cold and it's you know what are you

839
00:39:57,900 --> 00:39:56,589
worrying about and I've been a few

840
00:40:02,460 --> 00:39:57,910
months ago when who was seeing the body

841
00:40:05,430 --> 00:40:02,470
bags yes you know not a bad case in than

842
00:40:09,390 --> 00:40:05,440
if all that the terrifying things it

843
00:40:11,220 --> 00:40:09,400
doesn't look like we get immunity I know

844
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:11,230
the jury's still out on that but to

845
00:40:18,420 --> 00:40:14,170
think I could get this again and I'm

846
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:18,430
already out reduce lung capacity if it

847
00:40:21,870 --> 00:40:20,410
doesn't kill me in the first wave for

848
00:40:26,370 --> 00:40:21,880
goodness sake it's got a good chance it

849
00:40:28,380 --> 00:40:26,380
can in the second and so it just hits

850
00:40:31,500 --> 00:40:28,390
that moment and I was I was listening

851
00:40:35,010 --> 00:40:31,510
just today the median age now of serious

852
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:35,020
cases in the u.s. is 35 this isn't an

853
00:40:39,630 --> 00:40:38,050
old person sickness I'm not I'm not a

854
00:40:41,670 --> 00:40:39,640
young thing but I'm not an old thing

855
00:40:45,510 --> 00:40:41,680
putting my age straight out there hi

856
00:40:49,140 --> 00:40:45,520
everybody I'm 41 almost 42 aside from

857
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:49,150
having MS I'm extremely healthy you know

858
00:40:55,530 --> 00:40:52,930
I'm disabled I'm not sick and and it

859
00:40:58,559 --> 00:40:55,540
knocked me that hard and it's still

860
00:41:00,900 --> 00:40:58,569
knocking me this hard you know and as

861
00:41:03,660 --> 00:41:00,910
lovely Michelle said hey you're looking

862
00:41:07,859 --> 00:41:03,670
a lot less like death then you were just

863
00:41:10,079 --> 00:41:07,869
a couple weeks ago and it's true you

864
00:41:12,900 --> 00:41:10,089
know me little night owls know I'm to

865
00:41:14,970 --> 00:41:12,910
bed at 9:00 but I think on that note

866
00:41:16,740 --> 00:41:14,980
like if anyone wants to talk about this

867
00:41:17,970 --> 00:41:16,750
information that this information that

868
00:41:19,650 --> 00:41:17,980
was coming out at the beginning of this

869
00:41:21,870 --> 00:41:19,660
about how it's an old person's disease

870
00:41:24,240 --> 00:41:21,880
how you know oh it doesn't affect young

871
00:41:26,849 --> 00:41:24,250
people nearly every single patient that

872
00:41:29,579 --> 00:41:26,859
I saw in ICU who is ventilated was under

873
00:41:31,530 --> 00:41:29,589
the age of 60 and the worst ones that

874
00:41:33,900 --> 00:41:31,540
I've seen were younger than me and

875
00:41:35,670 --> 00:41:33,910
honestly when I was in hearing people

876
00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:35,680
saying about oh well I'll be fine I'll

877
00:41:41,059 --> 00:41:37,690
be fine I'm like how do you know you

878
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:41,069
don't know I'm not a smoker I'm

879
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:44,770
physically active I have good blood

880
00:41:49,980 --> 00:41:48,010
levels I have if you looked at my panel

881
00:41:51,569 --> 00:41:49,990
and paperwork you'd be like this is a

882
00:41:56,430 --> 00:41:51,579
person who's gonna think it's just a

883
00:42:00,569 --> 00:41:56,440
cold and no no it was not mm-hmm

884
00:42:03,170 --> 00:42:00,579
not even close and so I'm I'm mortified

885
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:03,180
about what's going on in the u.s. now

886
00:42:08,609 --> 00:42:06,490
huh now Trish you've been posting some

887
00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:08,619
pictures recently of lung damage I've

888
00:42:13,530 --> 00:42:11,050
noticed yeah I don't want to scare Kass

889
00:42:16,650 --> 00:42:13,540
I'm really sorry cuz it's like I've been

890
00:42:19,020 --> 00:42:16,660
through it I'm reformed don't worry I I

891
00:42:20,790 --> 00:42:19,030
have no doubt that I have got some lung

892
00:42:23,490 --> 00:42:20,800
damage and I have no doubt this is gonna

893
00:42:27,359 --> 00:42:23,500
take rehabilitation and it's gonna take

894
00:42:28,790 --> 00:42:27,369
time and I'm practice self-compassion

895
00:42:30,900 --> 00:42:28,800
right

896
00:42:33,690 --> 00:42:30,910
remind myself through yeah one of the

897
00:42:35,370 --> 00:42:33,700
things that the nuts a thing as well as

898
00:42:38,910 --> 00:42:35,380
you need to appreciate to that like

899
00:42:41,069 --> 00:42:38,920
every case is different so again I don't

900
00:42:43,140 --> 00:42:41,079
want to scare people but the damage that

901
00:42:45,329 --> 00:42:43,150
I've personally seen in patients has

902
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:45,339
been catastrophic I I can think of a few

903
00:42:49,950 --> 00:42:48,010
that will need full lung transplants to

904
00:42:50,250 --> 00:42:49,960
live anything even like a normal life

905
00:42:52,500 --> 00:42:50,260
again

906
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:52,510
and obviously as most people know after

907
00:42:55,050 --> 00:42:53,770
you've had any kind of transplant

908
00:42:57,660 --> 00:42:55,060
you don't live a normal life again

909
00:42:59,460 --> 00:42:57,670
because you're on your immunosuppressed

910
00:43:01,980 --> 00:42:59,470
and then you know you're recovering from

911
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:01,990
that transplant so the patients that

912
00:43:07,230 --> 00:43:04,210
I've seen that like I said we're talking

913
00:43:10,740 --> 00:43:07,240
mid 30s in some cases early 40s and

914
00:43:12,270 --> 00:43:10,750
their lungs are destroyed to the point

915
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:12,280
where you know their capacity is

916
00:43:17,190 --> 00:43:14,410
probably down by less than half of what

917
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:17,200
it used to be and in there in the x-rays

918
00:43:20,460 --> 00:43:18,970
and it well the CT scans really tell a

919
00:43:22,710 --> 00:43:20,470
bigger picture but the only even on the

920
00:43:24,780 --> 00:43:22,720
x-rays but a good pair of lungs are

921
00:43:27,750 --> 00:43:24,790
predominantly black because black on

922
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:27,760
x-ray is air but in these CT scans and

923
00:43:31,500 --> 00:43:29,650
in these x-rays of patients who have had

924
00:43:33,839 --> 00:43:31,510
and I'm not talking they have Kovac they

925
00:43:36,319 --> 00:43:33,849
are post covered they are according to

926
00:43:38,609 --> 00:43:36,329
the statistics recovered from Kovac

927
00:43:40,770 --> 00:43:38,619
their lungs are white there are just

928
00:43:42,359 --> 00:43:40,780
patches everywhere and we call it when

929
00:43:44,250 --> 00:43:42,369
it's in its active stage we call it

930
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:44,260
ground glass opacities because it looks

931
00:43:49,109 --> 00:43:46,810
like someone smashed a car window and

932
00:43:51,870 --> 00:43:49,119
filled your chest up with it but then

933
00:43:53,430 --> 00:43:51,880
the the scarring afterwards the amount

934
00:43:55,740 --> 00:43:53,440
of white that's there that that white

935
00:43:58,200 --> 00:43:55,750
scar tissue is not flexible it can't

936
00:44:00,630 --> 00:43:58,210
inflate and deflate as your lungs do

937
00:44:02,460 --> 00:44:00,640
it's rigid and so what that means then

938
00:44:05,309 --> 00:44:02,470
is that you're so limited in what you

939
00:44:07,980 --> 00:44:05,319
can do and like I said these people that

940
00:44:09,540 --> 00:44:07,990
I've seen are so young they might find

941
00:44:11,190 --> 00:44:09,550
that they can't go up and down stairs

942
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:11,200
they might then have to change where

943
00:44:15,420 --> 00:44:13,210
they live they might their entire lives

944
00:44:17,700 --> 00:44:15,430
are completely changed and it was such a

945
00:44:20,100 --> 00:44:17,710
in a case unfortunately here in Sydney

946
00:44:23,250 --> 00:44:20,110
most of these come from the cruise ship

947
00:44:25,110 --> 00:44:23,260
and it breaks my heart because these

948
00:44:27,330 --> 00:44:25,120
poor people were working on this cruise

949
00:44:28,950 --> 00:44:27,340
ship to support their families and now

950
00:44:30,570 --> 00:44:28,960
they're in a situation where their

951
00:44:32,790 --> 00:44:30,580
entire families are now supporting them

952
00:44:35,820 --> 00:44:32,800
because they can't even breathe normally

953
00:44:37,620 --> 00:44:35,830
and it is heartbreaking well the good

954
00:44:43,350 --> 00:44:37,630
news front I'm getting another text

955
00:44:46,350 --> 00:44:43,360
chest x-ray next weeks you know please

956
00:44:51,300 --> 00:44:46,360
do please do what would what what do you

957
00:44:53,850 --> 00:44:51,310
think it would take to I hate to use the

958
00:44:55,830 --> 00:44:53,860
term to wake up the population that's

959
00:44:58,200 --> 00:44:55,840
what that's what the anti-vaxxers always

960
00:45:00,360 --> 00:44:58,210
say wake up sheeple but but to get the

961
00:45:01,650 --> 00:45:00,370
general population to you know for the

962
00:45:02,610 --> 00:45:01,660
penny to drop I don't think it can

963
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:02,620
happen because you've got all these

964
00:45:07,020 --> 00:45:05,050
people saying it's not God's law and you

965
00:45:09,180 --> 00:45:07,030
can't do that it's my freedom blip and

966
00:45:13,050 --> 00:45:09,190
this is not so serious well it's it's

967
00:45:16,290 --> 00:45:13,060
getting pathological you know we we

968
00:45:19,350 --> 00:45:16,300
don't have a diagnosis yet for blatant

969
00:45:24,420 --> 00:45:19,360
denial of reality but it does seem that

970
00:45:29,250 --> 00:45:24,430
some people thrive on exactly that I

971
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:29,260
have my my schema of the world I have

972
00:45:35,790 --> 00:45:32,650
this this world view that everything has

973
00:45:38,850 --> 00:45:35,800
to fit in and it's very rigid and that's

974
00:45:40,950 --> 00:45:38,860
the thing is I make em you know really

975
00:45:44,460 --> 00:45:40,960
poking holes at the far right but the

976
00:45:46,470 --> 00:45:44,470
far left gets very rigid too right so

977
00:45:47,130 --> 00:45:46,480
these these extremist thoughts get very

978
00:45:52,860 --> 00:45:47,140
rigid

979
00:45:54,510 --> 00:45:52,870
worldview right and so if you don't want

980
00:45:56,130 --> 00:45:54,520
to poke holes in your scheme if you

981
00:45:58,740 --> 00:45:56,140
don't want have to reevaluate the whole

982
00:46:01,140 --> 00:45:58,750
thing then you need to find a way to get

983
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:01,150
it to mesh so it's just a head cold is a

984
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:04,210
great way to get it to mesh right it's

985
00:46:07,620 --> 00:46:06,370
there's other coronaviruses out I have a

986
00:46:09,270 --> 00:46:07,630
little knowledge I know we've been

987
00:46:11,700 --> 00:46:09,280
fighting this for a while this is just

988
00:46:14,310 --> 00:46:11,710
another one of those or hmm

989
00:46:16,590 --> 00:46:14,320
my favorite is God if it doesn't fit

990
00:46:18,420 --> 00:46:16,600
into your cinema it must be God I love

991
00:46:23,460 --> 00:46:18,430
that one so much that should be it a

992
00:46:26,579 --> 00:46:23,470
diagnosis it's this idea of

993
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:26,589
of schemas that schema also goes along

994
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:29,770
the lines of I'm I'm healthy therefore

995
00:46:34,079 --> 00:46:32,170
I'm invincible and I nature does not

996
00:46:36,150 --> 00:46:34,089
care how old you are nature does not

997
00:46:38,849 --> 00:46:36,160
carry your ethnicity or your religion

998
00:46:41,700 --> 00:46:38,859
nature dis acknowledges your God that's

999
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:41,710
not how this goes and the u.s. is facing

1000
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:44,530
it on two fronts the schema of white

1001
00:46:49,380 --> 00:46:46,810
supremacy and then the schema of healthy

1002
00:46:52,230 --> 00:46:49,390
means disease-free and what we're seeing

1003
00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:52,240
now is what happens right when schemas

1004
00:46:56,579 --> 00:46:54,490
collide in my world I am healthy

1005
00:46:59,400 --> 00:46:56,589
therefore I don't get sick so I don't

1006
00:47:02,280 --> 00:46:59,410
need a mask and and go anti science and

1007
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:02,290
go this go that in my world whites are

1008
00:47:07,380 --> 00:47:05,050
supreme so I can't get this budge and I

1009
00:47:09,270 --> 00:47:07,390
can't give this equal rights following

1010
00:47:11,490 --> 00:47:09,280
on from that that reminds me of

1011
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:11,500
something else I read last night about

1012
00:47:17,730 --> 00:47:14,170
reasons for rejecting a mask which was

1013
00:47:19,980 --> 00:47:17,740
again it's an identity thing where Trump

1014
00:47:24,630 --> 00:47:19,990
you know didn't wear a mask even in the

1015
00:47:27,599 --> 00:47:24,640
mass production so people who identify

1016
00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:27,609
with that are rejecting masks and it's

1017
00:47:34,589 --> 00:47:31,210
actually seen as weak if I wear a mask

1018
00:47:37,410 --> 00:47:34,599
I'm just weak that the I believe this

1019
00:47:40,650 --> 00:47:37,420
virus will get me I'm not scared

1020
00:47:43,050 --> 00:47:40,660
if I wear a mask I'm showing fear of the

1021
00:47:45,569 --> 00:47:43,060
virus and it's the same with the washing

1022
00:47:48,390 --> 00:47:45,579
hands you know for us talking to a kind

1023
00:47:50,490 --> 00:47:48,400
of a macho friend recently who was not

1024
00:47:54,319 --> 00:47:50,500
that fussed about hand-washing it's not

1025
00:47:56,940 --> 00:47:54,329
you know such a thing that building

1026
00:47:58,829 --> 00:47:56,950
construction workers may be necessarily

1027
00:48:02,819 --> 00:47:58,839
into and I say it's not about your

1028
00:48:05,309 --> 00:48:02,829
manlihood mate it germs don't you know

1029
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:05,319
work like that you can't be tough

1030
00:48:11,579 --> 00:48:08,410
against this thing do not shake hands

1031
00:48:14,220 --> 00:48:11,589
you know with your workers and friends

1032
00:48:16,770 --> 00:48:14,230
and I mean I do you do see around the

1033
00:48:18,450 --> 00:48:16,780
the meetings of building construction

1034
00:48:20,490 --> 00:48:18,460
workers where they are all socially

1035
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:20,500
distancing I think the message is like

1036
00:48:26,250 --> 00:48:23,410
quite strong but it's a masculinity

1037
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:26,260
thing to about I'm tough if I wear a

1038
00:48:31,230 --> 00:48:28,690
mask I'm weak if I wash my hands I'm

1039
00:48:34,530 --> 00:48:31,240
weak and that's I think Donald Trump's

1040
00:48:36,940 --> 00:48:34,540
angles to you know masks are for sissies

1041
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:36,950
is basically his line is

1042
00:48:40,780 --> 00:48:38,810
I've seen him in press conferences

1043
00:48:43,089 --> 00:48:40,790
chastised reporters for wearing masks

1044
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:43,099
saying you can be politically correct if

1045
00:48:48,700 --> 00:48:45,650
you like you know wow what did

1046
00:48:50,710 --> 00:48:48,710
politically correct get into this yeah I

1047
00:48:52,300 --> 00:48:50,720
wonder if we could go from a different

1048
00:48:55,359 --> 00:48:52,310
angle with this and I wonder if the

1049
00:48:57,880 --> 00:48:55,369
question can be why are you so afraid of

1050
00:48:59,740 --> 00:48:57,890
wearing a mask why are you so chicken

1051
00:49:01,630 --> 00:48:59,750
that you can't wear it like we're if you

1052
00:49:02,920 --> 00:49:01,640
can turn it the other way around and

1053
00:49:04,329 --> 00:49:02,930
make it like you know you're the one

1054
00:49:07,270 --> 00:49:04,339
that's afraid for not wearing it rather

1055
00:49:10,599 --> 00:49:07,280
than the other way around yeah a good

1056
00:49:12,780 --> 00:49:10,609
angle but you're right Trish we just

1057
00:49:17,370 --> 00:49:12,790
need to find that way to turn that

1058
00:49:21,130 --> 00:49:17,380
toxicity into a competition or a

1059
00:49:26,470 --> 00:49:21,140
cognitive dissonance or my mosque is

1060
00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:26,480
bigger than your mask look at Richard

1061
00:49:32,020 --> 00:49:28,400
what if they what if they made them

1062
00:49:34,180 --> 00:49:32,030
ready and wrote some horrible slogan

1063
00:49:35,890 --> 00:49:34,190
like their hats and then they can wear

1064
00:49:37,810 --> 00:49:35,900
it like a ball wives well so

1065
00:49:39,700 --> 00:49:37,820
interestingly there were some Trump

1066
00:49:41,170 --> 00:49:39,710
branded masks out there a little while

1067
00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:41,180
back which I saw but you know it was

1068
00:49:47,190 --> 00:49:42,530
really funny they were made of neoprene

1069
00:49:49,569 --> 00:49:47,200
so they were actually suffocating

1070
00:49:51,130 --> 00:49:49,579
viruses shouldn't be political it's

1071
00:49:53,349 --> 00:49:51,140
amazing that a virus

1072
00:49:56,079 --> 00:49:53,359
it doesn't care about humanity virus

1073
00:49:58,450 --> 00:49:56,089
husband I went I wonder what what party

1074
00:50:00,940 --> 00:49:58,460
the corona virus would vote for the one

1075
00:50:02,859 --> 00:50:00,950
that doesn't wear masks I bet that's

1076
00:50:04,450 --> 00:50:02,869
right let's wind up with a little

1077
00:50:06,670 --> 00:50:04,460
discussion now about something we're

1078
00:50:08,290 --> 00:50:06,680
doing right now we're meeting online I

1079
00:50:10,329 --> 00:50:08,300
can see the four of you up on my big

1080
00:50:11,890 --> 00:50:10,339
screen and I'm just hiding sort of in

1081
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:11,900
the corner of my screen and it's really

1082
00:50:16,059 --> 00:50:13,970
great and what we can communicate we can

1083
00:50:17,890 --> 00:50:16,069
do these sessions but I'm noticing more

1084
00:50:20,079 --> 00:50:17,900
and more on the uptake is quite

1085
00:50:22,809 --> 00:50:20,089
substantial in the skeptical community

1086
00:50:24,700 --> 00:50:22,819
of not only online talks have been

1087
00:50:27,819 --> 00:50:24,710
involved with couple in the last week

1088
00:50:29,710 --> 00:50:27,829
myself and I'm doing one on Monday but

1089
00:50:32,170 --> 00:50:29,720
now conferences are moving online like

1090
00:50:35,500 --> 00:50:32,180
our very own skeptic on is going to be

1091
00:50:37,690 --> 00:50:35,510
moving online yes our skeptics cafe is

1092
00:50:38,829 --> 00:50:37,700
going online well it has been for a

1093
00:50:42,309 --> 00:50:38,839
couple of months now and will continue

1094
00:50:44,800 --> 00:50:42,319
to do that for a while we also just lost

1095
00:50:48,730 --> 00:50:44,810
our venue we don't know if that's

1096
00:50:50,860 --> 00:50:48,740
related closing Dudek ovid or what so

1097
00:50:53,410 --> 00:50:50,870
we'll be online for quite a while

1098
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:53,420
but I've also been joining ones in other

1099
00:50:59,740 --> 00:50:57,050
states which is fantastic because you

1100
00:51:01,300 --> 00:50:59,750
know I see them advertised I think they

1101
00:51:04,900 --> 00:51:01,310
look interesting and can never

1102
00:51:07,240 --> 00:51:04,910
ordinarily go below now I've been to the

1103
00:51:10,180 --> 00:51:07,250
Sydney one and two of the Gold Coast

1104
00:51:13,900 --> 00:51:10,190
ones it's great to tune into things that

1105
00:51:17,730 --> 00:51:13,910
are happening overseas it's brought me

1106
00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:17,740
into greater contact with skeptics

1107
00:51:23,650 --> 00:51:20,690
internationally or interstate we work

1108
00:51:27,700 --> 00:51:23,660
together a little bit more now I think

1109
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:27,710
that's the silver lining I am actually

1110
00:51:33,790 --> 00:51:31,490
worried about that ending hmm I don't

1111
00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:33,800
know what how go in the future whether

1112
00:51:39,250 --> 00:51:36,530
people will occasionally still do an

1113
00:51:42,730 --> 00:51:39,260
online one when things get back to live

1114
00:51:45,310 --> 00:51:42,740
venues because I just think that it's

1115
00:51:47,500 --> 00:51:45,320
been a real bonus and I will be very

1116
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:47,510
sorry to see it drop off altogether well

1117
00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:49,970
I wonder when things sort of get back to

1118
00:51:53,470 --> 00:51:51,530
normal and we are meeting again in the

1119
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:53,480
pubs and we're having talks whether it

1120
00:51:57,040 --> 00:51:55,490
will be now common for those or in the

1121
00:51:59,050 --> 00:51:57,050
future to for them to be streamed at the

1122
00:52:01,180 --> 00:51:59,060
same time I think it's a good idea

1123
00:52:03,220 --> 00:52:01,190
especially and I'm hoping that if one

1124
00:52:05,680 --> 00:52:03,230
thing comes out of all this it's the

1125
00:52:07,900 --> 00:52:05,690
unacceptability of going to a public

1126
00:52:09,250 --> 00:52:07,910
place while you're ill that's the one

1127
00:52:12,210 --> 00:52:09,260
thing I'm really really hoping the

1128
00:52:14,590 --> 00:52:12,220
plumbers come yes and so if we can start

1129
00:52:16,810 --> 00:52:14,600
encouraging people okay you've got the

1130
00:52:18,520 --> 00:52:16,820
sniffles maybe watch it online and you

1131
00:52:21,010 --> 00:52:18,530
can still engage in discussion you can

1132
00:52:22,390 --> 00:52:21,020
still watch the talk and I think we

1133
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:22,400
should really be encouraging that

1134
00:52:27,070 --> 00:52:24,770
because the incentive if you get paid

1135
00:52:28,510 --> 00:52:27,080
sick leave for work then there's not as

1136
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:28,520
much of an incentive to come to work

1137
00:52:31,870 --> 00:52:29,810
when you're sick but when it comes to a

1138
00:52:34,540 --> 00:52:31,880
social event like you really are losing

1139
00:52:36,370 --> 00:52:34,550
out if you just don't go so I think we

1140
00:52:38,500 --> 00:52:36,380
need to do more to positively encourage

1141
00:52:40,810 --> 00:52:38,510
people to have that public health

1142
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:40,820
mindedness and to really think about the

1143
00:52:43,990 --> 00:52:42,290
consequences of their actions and if we

1144
00:52:46,030 --> 00:52:44,000
can do anything we can to encourage them

1145
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:46,040
to still be involved but just not put

1146
00:52:49,090 --> 00:52:47,330
anyone at risk I think we should be

1147
00:52:50,590 --> 00:52:49,100
doing it I've been seeing Michelle more

1148
00:52:52,870 --> 00:52:50,600
frequently than everybody else because

1149
00:52:55,930 --> 00:52:52,880
Brisbane skeptics has been doing Penn

1150
00:52:58,750 --> 00:52:55,940
Pacific zooms and it's it's been

1151
00:53:00,550 --> 00:52:58,760
wonderful you know hear these these

1152
00:53:02,890 --> 00:53:00,560
people that I absolutely adore that I

1153
00:53:04,660 --> 00:53:02,900
don't get to see enough and all of her

1154
00:53:07,269 --> 00:53:04,670
gorgeous bugs

1155
00:53:09,309 --> 00:53:07,279
we've been able to and so you know

1156
00:53:12,370 --> 00:53:09,319
connections that have been more strained

1157
00:53:16,569 --> 00:53:12,380
I think just generally in life are

1158
00:53:19,650 --> 00:53:16,579
coming back and coming back bigger and

1159
00:53:24,460 --> 00:53:19,660
bolder and stronger but if it's any

1160
00:53:27,309 --> 00:53:24,470
indication I do well I've gone from

1161
00:53:28,799 --> 00:53:27,319
being a university professor as the

1162
00:53:32,259 --> 00:53:28,809
skeptic zone listeners will know me as

1163
00:53:34,930 --> 00:53:32,269
to now I am becoming a clinical

1164
00:53:37,750 --> 00:53:34,940
counselor so I work in a counseling

1165
00:53:40,210 --> 00:53:37,760
practice now day in and day out and I

1166
00:53:43,059 --> 00:53:40,220
have a wonderful boss who is allowing us

1167
00:53:46,240 --> 00:53:43,069
to use telehealth as long as we need to

1168
00:53:48,039 --> 00:53:46,250
and I've asked my clients hey if you

1169
00:53:50,500 --> 00:53:48,049
guys need if you would benefit from

1170
00:53:53,230 --> 00:53:50,510
face-to-face and not a single one of

1171
00:53:55,450 --> 00:53:53,240
them wants to come in office they want

1172
00:53:57,220 --> 00:53:55,460
to go home from work they want to get

1173
00:53:59,109 --> 00:53:57,230
their dinner and they want to have a

1174
00:54:02,650 --> 00:53:59,119
therapy appointment at 7:00 p.m. with

1175
00:54:05,109 --> 00:54:02,660
their shoes off and that's amazing hmm

1176
00:54:07,089 --> 00:54:05,119
and that's wonderful and what they don't

1177
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:07,099
know is I only have a nice shirt on and

1178
00:54:10,450 --> 00:54:08,450
my face and hair done and I'm wearing

1179
00:54:16,049 --> 00:54:10,460
pajama pants and blue jeans and I love

1180
00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:16,059
it it's wonderful but I think too that

1181
00:54:21,789 --> 00:54:18,650
that's the new world we're going into

1182
00:54:25,180 --> 00:54:21,799
and I think it's a logical extension for

1183
00:54:27,599 --> 00:54:25,190
skeptics because we really were able to

1184
00:54:30,579 --> 00:54:27,609
interact with each other in you know

1185
00:54:33,490 --> 00:54:30,589
online forums the various Facebook

1186
00:54:36,130 --> 00:54:33,500
groups or Twitter or so on but just

1187
00:54:40,569 --> 00:54:36,140
taking that next step to actually talk

1188
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:40,579
in real time see people's faces you know

1189
00:54:47,109 --> 00:54:44,690
it's to me very natural and logical step

1190
00:54:49,660 --> 00:54:47,119
that follows on it's the year of senior

1191
00:54:51,849 --> 00:54:49,670
will to two of you guys who I'm looking

1192
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:51,859
at now I've never met in real life and

1193
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:53,690
the other two I spoke to four years

1194
00:54:59,109 --> 00:54:56,930
before we met in real life yes the the

1195
00:55:01,569 --> 00:54:59,119
the staring at the piece of glass

1196
00:55:04,809 --> 00:55:01,579
relationship I think has become a real

1197
00:55:06,579 --> 00:55:04,819
like that the kids are saying now is it

1198
00:55:08,559 --> 00:55:06,589
staring at the piece of glass relations

1199
00:55:11,950 --> 00:55:08,569
yeah it's a piece of glowing grah glass

1200
00:55:13,660 --> 00:55:11,960
that I carry in my pocket yes those are

1201
00:55:15,819 --> 00:55:13,670
real people in this they are real people

1202
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:15,829
no they're not they're not pretend

1203
00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:18,650
friends exactly and if

1204
00:55:24,010 --> 00:55:20,450
I've got seven clients I've never met

1205
00:55:28,660 --> 00:55:24,020
face to face well we have a therapeutic

1206
00:55:30,100 --> 00:55:28,670
relationship now I wonder in that

1207
00:55:33,550 --> 00:55:30,110
context do you think this might lead to

1208
00:55:34,690 --> 00:55:33,560
more people having therapy people who

1209
00:55:37,330 --> 00:55:34,700
would have been intimidated with the

1210
00:55:38,650 --> 00:55:37,340
hope of going into an office oh this

1211
00:55:41,590 --> 00:55:38,660
could be this could do amazing things

1212
00:55:43,720 --> 00:55:41,600
with society it's amazing and I'm hoping

1213
00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:43,730
the same happens for doctors in rural

1214
00:55:49,740 --> 00:55:46,850
areas and come on physician's assistant

1215
00:55:54,070 --> 00:55:49,750
it's called doc ceme doc see me it's

1216
00:55:55,660 --> 00:55:54,080
amazing and this is this is it I do I do

1217
00:55:58,150 --> 00:55:55,670
honestly think this will make society

1218
00:56:01,030 --> 00:55:58,160
better I like the idea of all the people

1219
00:56:03,730 --> 00:56:01,040
who have been denied the opportunity to

1220
00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:03,740
do these things having that that excuse

1221
00:56:07,540 --> 00:56:05,210
taken away like there's lots of people

1222
00:56:09,070 --> 00:56:07,550
working from home where their bosses

1223
00:56:10,630 --> 00:56:09,080
originally said I don't know we need you

1224
00:56:12,910 --> 00:56:10,640
in the office and now we're like well

1225
00:56:15,430 --> 00:56:12,920
actually I got my job done perfectly

1226
00:56:17,710 --> 00:56:15,440
fine from home so you can't use that

1227
00:56:20,230 --> 00:56:17,720
excuse anymore mm-hmm and I've actually

1228
00:56:21,850 --> 00:56:20,240
had a great experience in my job they

1229
00:56:23,500 --> 00:56:21,860
let me work from home for a bit and I

1230
00:56:25,930 --> 00:56:23,510
found that I was more productive in this

1231
00:56:27,970 --> 00:56:25,940
one aspect of it so now it's coming

1232
00:56:30,100 --> 00:56:27,980
around to doing that thing again and I

1233
00:56:32,470 --> 00:56:30,110
just said to my boss look it will take

1234
00:56:34,090 --> 00:56:32,480
me less time and I'll be better at it if

1235
00:56:36,970 --> 00:56:34,100
you just let me take all this stuff home

1236
00:56:38,520 --> 00:56:36,980
and do it and he said yeah just do

1237
00:56:40,900 --> 00:56:38,530
whatever is the best way to do your job

1238
00:56:44,350 --> 00:56:40,910
it's a changing world but it's always

1239
00:56:46,570 --> 00:56:44,360
been a changing world my my mother used

1240
00:56:49,630 --> 00:56:46,580
to say to me when I was young talking

1241
00:56:51,910 --> 00:56:49,640
about her grandfather so my

1242
00:56:54,130 --> 00:56:51,920
great-grandfather that when they first

1243
00:56:55,930 --> 00:56:54,140
got a television my great-grandfather

1244
00:56:58,330 --> 00:56:55,940
was convinced that the people on the

1245
00:57:02,310 --> 00:56:58,340
television could see them in their sound

1246
00:57:04,600 --> 00:57:02,320
room speaking about great-grandparents

1247
00:57:06,850 --> 00:57:04,610
dr. Cassandra you said something very

1248
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:06,860
funny I liked before oh yes my my

1249
00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:08,690
grandmother always used to describe

1250
00:57:13,420 --> 00:57:11,330
things that that lecture said 2020 is is

1251
00:57:18,250 --> 00:57:13,430
going fast but slow and she would always

1252
00:57:21,100 --> 00:57:18,260
call it flying like a snail definitely

1253
00:57:24,130 --> 00:57:21,110
flying like a snail it certainly is it's

1254
00:57:27,010 --> 00:57:24,140
a one we won't forget too soon but for

1255
00:57:29,320 --> 00:57:27,020
the moment I'd like to thank you all for

1256
00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:29,330
coming by and being in the think tank

1257
00:57:32,290 --> 00:57:31,850
one day we'll do it in real life is that

1258
00:57:34,930 --> 00:57:32,300
what the

1259
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:34,940
good so now in real life whatever face

1260
00:57:40,660 --> 00:57:38,810
meets place nice oh I see but for now

1261
00:57:42,460 --> 00:57:40,670
all over the world

1262
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:42,470
Michelle Biggers mom Michelle Franklin

1263
00:57:46,750 --> 00:57:44,570
dr. Cassandra Perryman and Trish Han

1264
00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:46,760
I'll hold up my little coffee mug here

1265
00:57:56,980 --> 00:57:49,250
and say cheers Cheers

1266
00:57:58,870 --> 00:57:56,990
and thank you could be wine hey that's a

1267
00:58:00,790 --> 00:57:58,880
good idea we should we should be on

1268
00:58:17,220 --> 00:58:00,800
California time actually now we can all

1269
00:58:17,230 --> 00:58:26,250
[Music]

1270
00:58:30,040 --> 00:58:28,360
thank you for listening to this week's

1271
00:58:31,900 --> 00:58:30,050
episode of the skeptic zone and thank

1272
00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:31,910
you to Michelle because mama shall

1273
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:34,370
Franklin dr. Cassandra Perryman and

1274
00:58:39,400 --> 00:58:37,250
Trish Han for taking part in the think

1275
00:58:41,560 --> 00:58:39,410
tank with me for this episode I think

1276
00:58:43,090 --> 00:58:41,570
we'll be doing more of those maybe aim

1277
00:58:44,500 --> 00:58:43,100
for about one a month and we get

1278
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:44,510
different reporters and maybe some

1279
00:58:50,080 --> 00:58:47,930
special guests in very enjoyable but

1280
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:50,090
privately I must say I do miss the old

1281
00:58:54,460 --> 00:58:53,210
days some years ago when we meet in

1282
00:58:57,220 --> 00:58:54,470
person at the club at the end of the

1283
00:58:59,680 --> 00:58:57,230
street over a dinner and do a think tank

1284
00:59:02,380 --> 00:58:59,690
session like that one day who knows

1285
00:59:06,820 --> 00:59:02,390
maybe again thank you to my new patreon

1286
00:59:11,200 --> 00:59:06,830
just in the last week in fact rather a

1287
00:59:15,130 --> 00:59:11,210
kind friend of mine has decided to join

1288
00:59:15,310 --> 00:59:15,140
up to be a patreon and you know who you

1289
00:59:17,650 --> 00:59:15,320
are

1290
00:59:20,770 --> 00:59:17,660
and thank you very much much ly

1291
00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:20,780
appreciated in fact folks are oh boy why

1292
00:59:25,750 --> 00:59:23,090
do I do it I've got my eye on a new

1293
00:59:28,510 --> 00:59:25,760
microphone for voice work here in the

1294
00:59:31,510 --> 00:59:28,520
skeptic and studios coming up on next

1295
00:59:34,090 --> 00:59:31,520
week's show another reading from the

1296
00:59:36,160 --> 00:59:34,100
book of Tim I think there's another

1297
00:59:37,060 --> 00:59:36,170
logical fallacy coming up we'll we'll

1298
00:59:39,790 --> 00:59:37,070
see about that

1299
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:39,800
also news of a prize for a psychic

1300
00:59:45,550 --> 00:59:42,490
ability now here in Australia we have a

1301
00:59:48,010 --> 00:59:45,560
$100,000 prize for anyone here in

1302
00:59:52,300 --> 00:59:48,020
Australia who can perform any psychic or

1303
00:59:55,570 --> 00:59:52,310
paranormal feat in a mutually agreed

1304
00:59:57,280 --> 00:59:55,580
test I noticed over in America well of

1305
01:00:00,100 --> 00:59:57,290
course there James Randi $1,000,000

1306
01:00:03,580 --> 01:00:00,110
prizes are not really active at the

1307
01:00:06,190 --> 01:00:03,590
moment but there is another prize just

1308
01:00:10,090 --> 01:00:06,200
come on the horizon news about that next

1309
01:00:12,010 --> 01:00:10,100
week but for this week this is Richard

1310
01:00:16,140 --> 01:00:12,020
Saunders signing off from Sydney

1311
01:00:21,580 --> 01:00:18,670
you've been listening to the skeptic

1312
01:00:28,270 --> 01:00:21,590
zone podcast please visit our website at

1313
01:00:31,770 --> 01:00:28,280
wwlp.com tax and to access the bat

1314
01:00:34,450 --> 01:00:31,780
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1315
01:00:37,720 --> 01:00:34,460
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1316
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:37,730
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1317
01:00:40,890 --> 01:00:40,010
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1318
01:00:43,570 --> 01:00:40,900
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1319
01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:43,580
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1320
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:46,970
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1321
01:00:52,060 --> 01:00:49,690
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1322
01:00:54,220 --> 01:00:52,070
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1323
01:00:56,530 --> 01:00:54,230
skeptic zone are not necessarily those